Dangers of Strut spacers

[ILKBOMB]

Thanks for a great detailed reply Macca,
taking everything you just stated into account for 4x4ing
the most 4x4ing i would do is driving up a un-made road/driveway...
In your books would it still be a complete no no or would they be ok ?

[Macca]

Thanks for a great detailed reply Macca,
taking everything you just stated into account for 4x4ing
the most 4x4ing i would do is driving up a un-made road/driveway...
In your books would it still be a complete no no or would they be ok ?

ILKBOMB

A question, do you think you will ever reach full extension of your suspension. If you can answer that with a no, you may be OK, hit a speed bump or a cattle grid a bit quick and that all changes.
Mate I am biased, I hate the idea of the things. We drove from west of Wanaaring (Camerons Corner way) to Dubbo with the strut broken as in the photo. That is nerve wracking. 650klm to the only place we could get parts on a Saturday Arvo.
I did sell them to a member here, with the recommendation that the bumps be extended.
I personally would not use them.
Max on here knows this stuff better than anyone else, he may have a suggestion that gets what you want at a budget price.

Macca

[ultimate]

Aftermarket coils are only around $220 a pair so you're much better off getting a decent set to suit your vehicle. The suspension goes hand in hand with the brakes and tyres as one of the most improtant safety features on the vehicle. You're only cheating yourself by taking short cuts.

[Steve9R]

i agree.. even though personally i had no bad experiences in the 18months I had spacers in, it dosent mean no one else has..

the cost of spacers is $200 new coils $220 as brendan says.. you do the math..

when i got mine though they were still pretty new on the market and new products were coming onto the market all the time.. if i had my time again and know what i know now and the products around now were around then, i wouldnt have used spacers either.. and i dont think macca would have either.. hindsight is a wonderful thing though..

Steve

[jackolux]

My little monument in Birdsville last week , it get a little sticky with a bit of rain
I had no Strut or Spring spacers fitted , so whats the answer guys , I have 2 new TJM - Gold Shocks to fit
I'm having second thoughts , maybe STD Toyota is the best

[Gillie]

This was something I was considering on my new hilux after the whinch and bar will undoubtly cause some drooping. But for me the bottom line is what price do you put on your kids life.... End of story. Thanks for the info everyone.

[Steve9R]

My little monument in Birdsville last week , it get a little sticky with a bit of rain
I had no Strut or Spring spacers fitted , so whats the answer guys , I have 2 new TJM - Gold Shocks to fit
I'm having second thoughts , maybe STD Toyota is the best

Hmm ugly.. same place the others broke..

what sort of lift do you have ? you had TJM gold shocks in it ? (what is that broken one?)

Steve

[Hilux Max]

you'd think they'd (shock manufacturers) would make a thicker lower shaft wouldnt ya?

seriously, in comparison to the rest of the shock that lower shaft is pretty narrow. Why cant they increase the shaft diamter by 50%, its not like it'll add to much more to price and it wont affect clearance, and the strength benefits would be huge!

[jackolux]

My little monument in Birdsville last week , it get a little sticky with a bit of rain
I had no Strut or Spring spacers fitted , so whats the answer guys , I have 2 new TJM - Gold Shocks to fit
I'm having second thoughts , maybe STD Toyota is the best

Hmm ugly.. same place the others broke..

what sort of lift do you have ? you had TJM gold shocks in it ? (what is that broken one?)

Steve

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn't have TJM - Gold Shocks fitted , I called into Mildura TJM and have been given TJM - Gold Shocks to replace the now discontinued Yellow shocks , it was the second yellow shock that I have broken , the first one last year .
The Gold Shocks are supposed to overcome the problem ( we will see ) I wouldn't put money on it ,

The very next day another HiLux arrived in Birdsville with a broken " Nitro Max " front shock

After inspecting the broken shock , we think the bottom rubber bush collapses and let the bottom shock eye bind on the Wish Bone and the shock eventually breaks , its not just one big hit

Believe me its a Huge PITA and needs to be overcome , before someone gets hurt or worse and the shit really hits the fan , it could go all the way back to the shock manufacturer

[Macca]

To add more confusion to this problem.
Tracks like the Simpson have lots of moguls as you head up the sand ridges.
The suspension often is at full droop as you tend to need a bit of momentum so the front end tends to get airborn or nearly airborn many times.
The strut stops the bottom travel of the front suspension so takes a fair hiding stopping the front wheel, brakes etc each time.
The continious impact will no doubt stress the bushes and/or welds that have been failing.
Off topic in regards to the spacers, but may be part of the reason the struts fail.
Macca

[ultimate]

The spacers are definitely a major cause of the strut failures and damage to driveline components which is why we don’t supply or recommend anybody use them. With the Hilux in particular, the bushes are often over looked but are also a contributing factor. We've seen many cases both here in Australia and overseas where the incorrect bushing design has resulted in the strut collapsing or binding. When we were in Dubai, nearly every 200 Series owner was telling us how worried they were about the problem because of how frequently it happens (especially with the armoured plated vehicles).

We learnt about the problem very early on when it originated with the Prado. Ever since then we have had stronger struts and have used either a bearing, or custom bush instead of the standard design. Since implementing these designs, we have not had one strut failure. Luckily a lot of other companies are now introducing the same technology which is good for the safety of the whole industry and drivers alike.

[ILKBOMB]

Ok thanks alot for that great thread!
Ill cross these of my list and just stick to a proper suspension
Think Ill go with an EFS setup

[jackolux]

Hmmm , interesting , I'm not sure what to do now do I fit the new TJM - Gold shocks " are they good enough "
anyone know if the changes from the yellow TJM shocks has fixed the problem .

The ultimate shocks do sound good if there has been no failures ,

Brendan does the HiLux shock have a custom bush or a bearing , what is a custom bush how is it different , I would like to see one , would you care to post a photo

After 2 broken shocks this time I want the job right , I don't need a third

Regards Jacko

[ultimate]

PM sent

[Bigmanaaron]

Hello All,
I am new to a Hilux. I am a missionary living in Papua New Guinea. I love my Hilux and would like to get some more information on Lift Kits. We live in the bush and need about 50mm lift. What does everyone reccomend? They roads here are really bad, we don't go 4x4ing we live with it. On some roads I bottom out with my 2005 Toyota Hilux. The thing about changing the lift, I will have to do it my self, and I have never done that before. I know how to do it, but talking about it and doing it aren't the same.
I would like to get bigger tyres and rims, but don't think with the stock set up. Any help out there would be great.
Thanks,
Bigmanaaron,
Papua New Guinea
'05 Hilux 4 door 2.5 turbo diesel

[ultimate]

PM Sent

[nzuky]

I'm confused... (well it might not be me)

When you fit the strut spacer the shock MAY limit the travel of the wheel before the bump stop. If this was the case the strut would then take the full load, which possibly could cause the breakages shown. If this was the case the SOLUTION would be to fit a bump stop spacer! This would then allow the bump stop not the strut to take this load.

This seems like a pretty good cheap lift solution, especially if you have fitted a bar and winch and want to balance things out.

The CV angle and all that is another topic all together.

No one seems to have noted that shocks are a replaceable part. They are not designed to last the life of the vehicle. Especially if they are being thrashed down corrugations a lot. Why isn't there a thread about the dangers of brake pads wearing down, or tyres going bald?

Hugo

[VMN]

I'm confused...
When you fit the strut spacer the shock MAY limit the travel of the wheel before the bump stop. If this was the case the strut would then take the full load, which possibly could cause the breakages shown. If this was the case the SOLUTION would be to fit a bump stop spacer! This would then allow the bump stop not the strut to take this load.
Hugo

Yes you got that right, but you'd have to check the legalities of the bump stop. I guess the point is that by fitting these spacers you do face risks most people who do it are not aware of.

No one seems to have noted that shocks are a replaceable part. They are not designed to last the life of the vehicle. Especially if they are being thrashed down corrugations a lot. Why isn't there a thread about the dangers of brake pads wearing down, or tyres going bald?

Hugo

Fair comment but you see pictures of broken struts when you don't set them up right, but you don't see pictures of broken brake pads. You don't expect a shock to break. This happens when spacers are fitted. When it does break, things dangle around and there are risks from this which I would not like to face at highway speeds. Sure I would be happy replacing shocks where the internals have gone through fair wear and tear though.

[pootrol]

hey mate i hear what your saying. i have fitted spacers front to get a cheap lift for now and have spaced the bump stops. if you do this lift you will need to have your front wheels re-alligned by some one or it will upset the vehicle so its not as easy as slapping them in and going. i didnt believe spending money on ifs was worth it but after seeing some trucks with good susp perform next to me changed my mind. the other prob is the quality of the stock shock is crap and is not reliable.for what your saying do you want the worry of snapping the end off the stock shock in the middle of no where and rendering the vehicle useless.the work you have to do to put the spacers in you might as well get pre-assembled struts sent to you as its the same work. you cant just slip the spacers in you need to remove the strut to bolt them on and that requires some undoing. brake pads dont stop a car dead in its tracks if there buggered and if a tyre blows you have a spare. snap that front shock the vehicle needs a flat bed or a replacement part to get it going.

[Macca]

Hugo, I can assure you I am not confused about the use of these spacers, a catastrophic failure is not in the same category as a replacement part.
Yes they wear out, and are replaced when convienient, but when the fall apart that is a different story.
There are a few on this forum with much more knowledge than me of how this type of suspension works and all agree that my experience with a strut failure would probably not have happened if bump stop extensions had been fitted.
Your "solution" has been kicked around the workshop a few time already, theres no need to shout
Feel free to start a thread about items wearing out...
Macca