1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Turbo, Manifolds, Exhaust, Intercooler, Internals etc

1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby thehof31 on Fri, 13 Mar 2015 4:48 +0000

Hey all,

Hoping someone might be able to shed some light on what might be wrong with my 2004 Hilux KZN165 - 1kz-te. Hard to explain but here goes!!

There is a noticeable loss of power and hesitation when accelerating - its almost like the engine goes into limp mode and kind of feels and sounds like the turbo doesn't spool up when she gets hot. I think the problem is there when the engines cold too but just not as noticeable. Sometimes (and rarely these days), she gets up goes as it should but as soon as it gets hot or if I've been at idle for a while, it just loses all its power. I have noticed when the weather is cooler that it seems to run a lot better - I live in Darwin so it's pretty rare for the weather to be "cooler" :). Fuel consumption is up too - running about 14L/100km.

I've checked just about everything I can possibly think of and here's a list of what that is. I have a scan tool and it is showing no error codes and everything reads as it should. The only thing I noticed was that the injection volume reduces when the problem occurs but i'm ruling out injectors as it does run right on occasions - seems like something is telling the ECU to give it less fuel.

I have checked:
Water Temp Sensor - ok - runs around 92 degrees C on a 32 degree day.
Air Intake Sensor - ok
Turbo Pressure Sensor - ok - actually replaced this and no difference
Fuel Temp Sensor - ok
Timing Control Valve Sensor - ok
Engine Speed Sensor - ok
Spill Control Valve Checked - ok
Fuel Filter changed, fuel lines blown out, fuel tank cleaned and filter in tank cleaned
All filters in the injection pump have been removed and cleaned
Air Filter Changed
EGR has been blocked off - at the exhaust (could this need blocking off at the intake manifold?)
Plenum pipe was removed and cleaned - had a massive amount of soot on the throttle butterfly (thought i'd fixed the problem when I saw that but its still there)
Checked for vacuum leaks as best as I can

Apart from the loss of power, the engine doesn't miss a beat. She's done 325K with a full service history with oils changed at 10k intervals. Starts first time, every time. No leaks. Not blowing smoke. No rattles or unusual noises.

This has really got me stumped! Love the car but it's not a real pleasure to drive ATM.

Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated...especially if someone's had the same issue. Sorry for the long post - thought it might help to get all the info I had out at once!

Thoughts anyone? ECU?

Cheers
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby boxhead55 on Fri, 13 Mar 2015 5:21 +0000

That particular fuel pump.had an issue with this. The advance unit which is at the bottom of the fuel pump assembly slowly scrubs a grove in the aluminum housing. Causing the fuel advance to get stuck in a retarded position when it needs to be advanced.
This will also cause your turbo to not spool up as there is not enough compression at the right time to get the turbo spinning.
Sorry but sound like you may be up for a new fuel pump.
Just an FYI. You can get a bran new Toyota pump for cheaper then a reconditioned one.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby boxhead55 on Fri, 13 Mar 2015 5:26 +0000

Image
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby thehof31 on Fri, 13 Mar 2015 5:36 +0000

boxhead55 wrote:That particular fuel pump.had an issue with this. The advance unit which is at the bottom of the fuel pump assembly slowly scrubs a grove in the aluminum housing. Causing the fuel advance to get stuck in a retarded position when it needs to be advanced.
This will also cause your turbo to not spool up as there is not enough compression at the right time to get the turbo spinning.
Sorry but sound like you may be up for a new fuel pump.
Just an FYI. You can get a bran new Toyota pump for cheaper then a reconditioned one.




Oh dear.... I was hoping that wasn't going to be the case!! Is there anyway this can be tested or inspected prior to shelling out the dollars for a new pump? I would like to be 100% sure if I gotta spend the dollars on it.

Thanks for the feedback..... I've not heard of that problem before!
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby boxhead55 on Fri, 13 Mar 2015 5:40 +0000

Yes you can remove the cap and look inside and with your km. You will surely find score marks in the housing.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby boxhead55 on Fri, 13 Mar 2015 5:41 +0000

I did have a good bora scope pic of a bad one but can not find it at the moment.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby thehof31 on Fri, 13 Mar 2015 5:46 +0000

Thanks again.... i'll remove the cap, check it out and let you know what I find!
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby thehof31 on Sat, 14 Mar 2015 8:37 +0000

OK.... so took the cap off this morning and had a bit of a look. Could not see anything unusual in there... no score marks, pitting or gouges. Looks all pretty clean to me.... in saying that I've not inspected in there before and can't find any pics of it. The cap and springs look to be in good condition also.

I'll try post some pics.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby thehof31 on Sat, 14 Mar 2015 8:47 +0000

Silly question.... how do I post pics on here? Computer won't let me cut/paste??

Thought I'd worked it out but it seems I haven't! :(

Another question: should the piston in there be free to move? It seemed like it was stuck solid.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby DIETERVOEGELI on Wed, 25 Nov 2015 6:07 +0000

Hi theno, did you get any results?
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Cobbo on Tue, 01 Mar 2016 8:47 +0000

Same problem, 2005 KZN165r with 250000 kms. Dyno 53.8kw 190nm prior to the following. A long way below the specified 97kw and 287nm. I realise these are not rear wheel figures but I am down 44% in kW and 34% in torque. Drive train losses aren't that much. Something's wrong.

It has 9R15 tyres which are the same diameter as standard split rims so it's not wheels.

I also had manifold cleaned, EGR block at intake manifold, boost is 10.7psi, compression checked 29 28 28 27, all new filters, fuel lines blown out with compressed air. Bit the bullet and replaced injector pump (new genuine) and injectors. Back to dyno and no change 54.1kw and 190 mn.

We also checked another hilux on same dyno straight after mine so same conditions (40deg c). It had 144000km and no work done on engine other than normal service from new and it made 64.8kw and gave the owner a drive of mine and he confirmed it felt very sluggish compared to his.

Have managed to get an OBD reader to work, (can elaborate if any of you want to know how) and intake air temperature can get to 75deg c when parked and idling on a 40 deg day but geneally sits aroun 55-60 driving so not ideal but intake is standard taking air from inside the guard so I assume these figures are normal. Coolant temperature sits around 86-88 driving and can get to 93 when sitting at idle, all normal. Interesting to note that factory temp gauge never moves from 1/3.

So far spent around $5000 with no improvement :(

Not trying to hot it up, just restore power. Open to any ideas, this has got me stumped. HELP!!! What am I missing???
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby goldiexxxx on Sat, 05 Mar 2016 2:44 +0000

Yes, please elaborate on how you got OBD reader to work on 1KZ-TE

What about your MAP sensor? If its not working or the hose to it from the throttle body is split, then the engine will only deliver less fuel............. less power. Try taking the hose completely off the MAP sensor and clamp it shut. Drive it around and see if there is no change. If so, then its probably not working, or the filter is blocked.
I realise you have already replaced the sensor, what about the hose and or filter?

What about throttle position sensor?

Have you replaced any of the air intake hoses? These fancy coloured looking ones sometimes can suck themselves flat and restrict the air to the turbo, especially if they get warm and soften up. Get the go-pro under the hood maybe...... just a mad thought. This often wont happen just by revving the engine without a load on it.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Cobbo on Sat, 05 Mar 2016 9:37 +0000

Thank you for your reply. To elaborate on OBD reader.

I purchased (2015 Vgate Mini ELM327 OBD2 OBDII Bluetooth CAN Scanner for TORQUE ANDROID) from EBAY, $16.70. Then got the android app (torque pro) from Play Store. When setting up profile select (use alternate OBD header). Then in the very advanced setting click on the ?. This will take you to a page with alternate code to be copied into the very advanced setting. Copy the string for "Toyota Celica ZZT230" and paste it in the very advanced setting. The app will now read your 1KZ-TE OBD :). The only issue I have had is for some reason I have to restart the app each time I start the engine or it fails to connect. Not a biggy but I am still learning and hopefully can find a fix for this soon. Let me know how you go.

Thank you for the other tips. I will look into those over the next few days and report back.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Cobbo on Thu, 10 Mar 2016 12:14 +0000

Goldy, tested MAP, all good. Did your GoPro suggestion, also OK.

Thinking along the air intake temp line now so have ordered a snorkel to give it some cool air.

I did try the rest of the EGR delete and removed the throttle plate. Interesting result. It reduced power so I will be replacing the throttle plate. Doesn't make sense but for some reason it is required. On all my research it should have improved performance due to no more restrictions in the manifold but it didn't. Shut down is only marginally rougher, perfectly OK. Boost rises much quicker without it but performance reduced. Don't feel it come on boost like it did despite the quicker boost. Some how the ECU is scheduling less fuel, fuel scheduling can't be directly related to MAP, removing the plate messed it up. No engine codes, Interesting????
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Cobbo on Mon, 14 Mar 2016 7:13 +0000

Seems to have taken some time for the ECU to adjust to the removed throttle plate, power has returned to similar to pre-removal. I will still be replacing the plate as I prefer the increased engine braking and smoother shut down it provides.

Snorkel now fitted. Intake temperature now always within 10 deg of ambient. That's a decrease of between 25-35 deg. Much better performance and not as effected by hot days.

Haven't dyno checked yet but seems to have cured my issues. It seems Mr Toyota fell short on intake design in a hot climate. Taking air from inside guard, big fail.

Even if heat soaked, the intake temp returns to within 10 deg of ambient after driving for 5 mins. :)
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby goldiexxxx on Wed, 16 Mar 2016 5:10 +0000

I thought your symptoms sounded like it was leading to an overheating problem, but I thought it would have been coolant temp prior to air intake temp.
I once had a similar incident with my 2H diesel in a HJ75 troopy. I was towing a large boat through hilly / winding road and therefore was doing a lot of hard acceleration in an attempt to maintain momentum, but was not able to gain enough speed to get some decent air flow through the radiator. The heat soak, while not totally boiling the coolant, caused a dramatic loss of power, worsening the problem. Of course that old engine was about two decades from knowing what an ECU was.. ha ha.

What size exhaust system do you have? Bigger exhaust will help to not only improve performance, but lower temps too. One's a cause of the other I suppose..............

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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Cobbo on Fri, 18 Mar 2016 6:38 +0000

Exhaust is standard. Engine is standard other than blanking plate in EGR. It does have a bull bar and large spotties which would have an effect on air flow. Cooling system in good condition with genuine Toyota coolant.

Did a little more testing with the snorkel fitted. The harder it is working, the closer to ambient the intake temp gets and the coolant temp only rises to low 90's at 100kph on a long uphill but quickly returns to norm, mid 80's when load reduced. Was going to high 90's before snorkel and took forever to reduce again. Pulls much better now.

Throttle plate has been replaced, seems to pull better from low rpm with it in and about the same at high rpm. Not sure of the physics around this but this is what I found in practice. Engine braking is back as well as the smooth shut down.

My intention was never to hot it up, just restore original power and achieve more acceptable temps. Quite happy. It now has respectable power and better temps in +40deg heat.

I think I could improve it further by insulating the metal air box as it heat soaks in the under bonnet heat, competing with the cool air from the snorkel.
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Monaz on Fri, 25 Mar 2016 7:13 +0000

Mate, not sure if you have fixed this problem or not, but one other reason these fail to spool up and seem down on power is the vacuum hose that you tap into to feed a boost gauge gets oiled up and slides off the valve its attached too. I have had this exact problem occur many times. All you need to do is replace the hose and use a small hose clamp to hold it in place.

Its on the battery side of the engine at the rear under the intercooler shroud. Its pretty easy to find as its on the top side of the motor. Hope this helps....
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Tassie hilux on Sun, 25 Sep 2016 3:29 +0000

Hey guys I'm having a similar problem with my 2004 hilux with the 1kzte has had the problem ever since I bought it had car on the dyno 60 kW at wheels air fuel ratio seems ok 17.7:1 compression ratios all over 500 psi I'm thinking it could be the fuel pump timing basically the car is down on power all the time compared to one that drives the way it should but once you tow or hit a big hill it feels like your dragging a couple of tonne behind you any ideas anyone I don't have much hair left have checked most of the basics
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Re: 1kz-te Loss Of Power Issue - HELP!!

Postby Cobbo on Wed, 22 Feb 2017 7:04 +0000

Thanks for all your help guys. Finally got to the bottom of this loss off power issue and got my power back.

Two issues found. The first was an air leak due to the fuel line wearing through between the fuel filter and the injector pump (rubbing on the air cleaner). Replaced fuel line.

The second was the accelerator pedal had bent over time so that foot flat on the floor was only giving 85% throttle (electronic throttle). Bent pedal back so I now get %100 throttle. Easy to check. On the top of the throttle pedal you will see and feel the arm that it pushes. Push the throttle to the floor and check that there is no free play in the rod that the pedal pushes. If there is bend the pedal up in very small increments until the rod reaches full travel as the pedal hits the floor.

Spent $5000 over 14 months looking for the power loss. (got a cheap but proven good condition second hand injector pump if anyone wants one).

Two cheap but bloody hard to find issues found, BUGGER, but also WOOHOO ITS FIXED.
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