Legalities of a 2" Lift and 32" Tyres

[7mmMagnum]

G'day guys,

So I'm in the process of getting a quote on a new SR Dual Cab Chassis & will be replacing the rims with a set of 18x9" Allied Rock rims & BFG KO2's............

The dealer has told me his tyre guy reckons:


"The biggest Legal tyre you can go on a Hilux with ESC is a 265/60r18…
 
If the customer is wanting to go to a 275/65r18 there is no difference legally  between this and a 265/65r18.
 
It’s a crap law that is getting policed at the moment.."


Any thoughts on if this is crap or not?

[abashii]

You can go 50mm up on a vehicle with ESC provided you aren't fitting a suspension or body lift. No idea whether the hilux actually has ESC though.

[HK1837]

You "can" but every % larger you go in tyre diameter your brakes are less effective by that same %. To do it right your brake rotor diameter needs to be increased by the same % as the tyres go up. Why do you think a 2012 Hilux has bigger brakes than 2011? It is because the tyre diameter increased going from 15" wheels to 17".

[Bschotty]

G'day guys,

So I'm in the process of getting a quote on a new SR Dual Cab Chassis & will be replacing the rims with a set of 18x9" Allied Rock rims & BFG KO2's............

The dealer has told me his tyre guy reckons:


"The biggest Legal tyre you can go on a Hilux with ESC is a 265/60r18…
 
If the customer is wanting to go to a 275/65r18 there is no difference legally  between this and a 265/65r18.
 
It’s a crap law that is getting policed at the moment.."


Any thoughts on if this is crap or not?

What state are you in?

[James_k]

How did you go with this? Which size did you end up settling on?

[Scoobalimalima]

Take a look at VSB14

https://infrastructure.gov.au/roads/veh ... 015_v4.pdf

SLL

[MINJIN]

The rules in QLD is Max 50mm larger diameter in wheel size than oem. And Max 50mm suspension lift. The combination of which can not exceed 75mm. Ie. 2 inch suspension lift means you can only go 25mm bigger in wheel/tyre size, so usually one size bigger. All info on https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au

[Tyson2Field]

Hi all, new poster here, and my apologies if this has been answered before, but I'm looking for the most up to date information. I live in Victoria, and I'm wondering about the legalities of my planned lift and new tyres for my Hilux. It's a 2009 Dual Cab Hilux SR5, and I'd like to fit a 2" lift and some 18x9" rims, with 285/60x18 All Terrain Tyres (it's my daily driver, and I'm not putting muds on it) I just have two questions - first, is this legal, or will I need a VASS certificate? Second, what kind of offset will I need? I'm thinking +/-0, will this do? Will the 32's rub? I'm going to get some aftermarket flares - Kut Snake.

[HK1837]

Most States follow the new Engineering COP, which states a maximum of 75mm as a combination of suspension and tyre increase. If suspension is 2" you have already used 50.8mm of the 75mm allowed, so you have 24.2mm left in tyres.

285/60/18 are metric tyres and are by design 799.2mm tall (under 31.5" tall) but this may vary by manufacturer (not sure why people still talk imperial when the tyres are metric but it seems to be everywhere?).

Your 2009 SR5 originally had 255/70/15 tyres which are 738mm tall. Which are 61.2mm shorter than the 285/60/18. Divide that by two to get the tyre radius increase which equates to your lift and you have a 30.6mm tyre lift, which is too big - you only can have 24.2mm with the 2" lift.

To be legal you'll have to stay below a 786.4mm tyre (roughly 31") which means basically a tyre like a 265/65/17 which are 776.3mm. Or something close like 265/70/16 or 265/60/18. Even a 275/65/17 puts you over.

On top of this your front brakes will need updating to cope with the tyre diameter increase. When Toyota first fitted 265/65/17 to a Hilux in 2008 they fitted 338mm x 28mm rotors and bigger calipers. When they later put 265/65/17 on some Hilux in 2011, and then on most models in 2012 they fitted 319mm x 28mm rotors. Yours are 297mm x 25mm and are designed for far smaller tyre diameter.

[Tyson2Field]

Most States follow the new Engineering COP, which states a maximum of 75mm as a combination of suspension and tyre increase. If suspension is 2" you have already used 50.8mm of the 75mm allowed, so you have 24.2mm left in tyres.

285/60/18 are metric tyres and are by design 799.2mm tall (under 31.5" tall) but this may vary by manufacturer (not sure why people still talk imperial when the tyres are metric but it seems to be everywhere?).

Your 2009 SR5 originally had 255/70/15 tyres which are 738mm tall. Which are 61.2mm shorter than the 285/60/18. Divide that by two to get the tyre radius increase which equates to your lift and you have a 30.6mm tyre lift, which is too big - you only can have 24.2mm with the 2" lift.

To be legal you'll have to stay below a 786.4mm tyre (roughly 31") which means basically a tyre like a 265/65/17 which are 776.3mm. Or something close like 265/70/16 or 265/60/18. Even a 275/65/17 puts you over.

On top of this your front brakes will need updating to cope with the tyre diameter increase. When Toyota first fitted 265/65/17 to a Hilux in 2008 they fitted 338mm x 28mm rotors and bigger calipers. When they later put 265/65/17 on some Hilux in 2011, and then on most models in 2012 they fitted 319mm x 28mm rotors. Yours are 297mm x 25mm and are designed for far smaller tyre diameter.

Thanks HK1837 - I was already considering a brake upgrade, and rear conversion to discs, so if I'm understanding right, as long as I go with a brake upgrade also, I can fit ~ 31" tyres, or get 32's, provided I get a VASS certificate and a modplate? Thanks for your help!

[HK1837]

I wouldn't bother with rear discs, a 120 Series 'cruiser front brake upgrade (same s 2008-2009 TRD) is enough. I've done that and also about to upgrade the booster too.

You'll be able to fit 265/65/17 tyres without any dramas (or the 16 or 18" varieties that are the same diameter) as the TRD Hilux has these, and they are less than 75mm overall lift with the 2" suspension lift, but I doubt you'll be able to get it Engineered for any bigger, as the NCOP says 75mm maximum. But talk to an Engineer about it, and get him/her to do the brake approval at the same time. If you stick to guidelines it is normally a snack but still get proper advice from an Engineer in your State.

Note if you stick with the original 17x7.5mm wheel size in I think 30P offset you won't need flares, they fit perfectly under the 2009 SR5 and don't scrub anywhere. A 17x8 with a 20-25P might work too but may also scrub. Original 120 Landcruiser Prado 17x7.5 or 2011 diesel SR5 17x7.5 or 2012-2105 SR5 17x7.5 are all 30P. Speedy make a few different 17x7.5 rims in 30P too and a few others in 17x8 that can be varied to order. They also do a black 17x8 Sunraysia in 25P too.

[Tyson2Field]

I wouldn't bother with rear discs, a 120 Series 'cruiser front brake upgrade (same s 2008-2009 TRD) is enough. I've done that and also about to upgrade the booster too.

You'll be able to fit 265/65/17 tyres without any dramas (or the 16 or 18" varieties that are the same diameter) as the TRD Hilux has these, and they are less than 75mm overall lift with the 2" suspension lift, but I doubt you'll be able to get it Engineered for any bigger, as the NCOP says 75mm maximum. But talk to an Engineer about it, and get him/her to do the brake approval at the same time. If you stick to guidelines it is normally a snack but still get proper advice from an Engineer in your State.

Note if you stick with the original 17x7.5mm wheel size in I think 30P offset you won't need flares, they fit perfectly under the 2009 SR5 and don't scrub anywhere. A 17x8 with a 20-25P might work too but may also scrub. Original 120 Landcruiser Prado 17x7.5 or 2011 diesel SR5 17x7.5 or 2012-2105 SR5 17x7.5 are all 30P. Speedy make a few different 17x7.5 rims in 30P too and a few others in 17x8 that can be varied to order. They also do a black 17x8 Sunraysia in 25P too.

Allright, I'm still thinking flares for the look, more than anything else, with 18x9" rims (275/60x18 tyres should also stay within the limits, and I can get both the Fuel Neutron rims, and All Terrain tyres locally, which is a plus) - I was also considering a brake booster - would that be enough of an initial brake upgrade, in your opinion? Assuming I were to upgrade the rest a few months later? With a 0 offset, the tyres will still be covered by the new rims, would I probably still get scrubbing? I have a bullbar, and will be replacing it with an aftermarket Rhino 4x4 hoopless bumper/bullbar, so I assume I won't get scrubbing on the front, due to the extra clearance. Once again, thanks for your help!

[where'smycat]

Hey mate. Not to rain on your parade, but if you're that worried about the tyre size you may want to check your offset as well. I know in NSW you can only (technically.... ) increase track width by 25mm in total, so 12.5mm each side.

[grunf]

.... and wrong section of the forum, his car is 2009 model. This section is 2015+

[Tyson2Field]

Woah, sorry about that, I must have bumped the wrong section when I went to post - can we get a mod to move this thread? @where'smycat, after a little more research, I think I'm just going to get some 17x9" rims with some 265/65x17 Tyres - they're nearly 31", but not much wider - though I will go with a 0P offset. As for width, I live in Victoria, and re-reading and double checking over the legislation, the tyres just can't extend past the fender flares - which I'll be replacing with wider ones anyway. Cheers for the help everyone!

[hiluxxury]

Woah, sorry about that, I must have bumped the wrong section when I went to post - can we get a mod to move this thread? @where'smycat, after a little more research, I think I'm just going to get some 17x9" rims with some 265/65x17 Tyres - they're nearly 31", but not much wider - though I will go with a 0P offset. As for width, I live in Victoria, and re-reading and double checking over the legislation, the tyres just can't extend past the fender flares - which I'll be replacing with wider ones anyway. Cheers for the help everyone!

I think you are limited to 25mm width increase on each side (this increase must be covered by mudguards). These regulations can be very hard to navigate.. however I think its the vicroads VSI8 talks about this specifically.

[Tyson2Field]

Woah, sorry about that, I must have bumped the wrong section when I went to post - can we get a mod to move this thread? @where'smycat, after a little more research, I think I'm just going to get some 17x9" rims with some 265/65x17 Tyres - they're nearly 31", but not much wider - though I will go with a 0P offset. As for width, I live in Victoria, and re-reading and double checking over the legislation, the tyres just can't extend past the fender flares - which I'll be replacing with wider ones anyway. Cheers for the help everyone!

I think you are limited to 25mm width increase on each side (this increase must be covered by mudguards). These regulations can be very hard to navigate.. however I think its the vicroads VSI8 talks about this specifically.

I think (I'll double check later) that the new tyres are roughly the stock width (90% sure they wouldn't be 25mm on each side) - and I was just looking at new mudguards just in case.

[HK1837]

If you are going for 0 offset rims though and originals are 30P then you have a track increase of 60mm. That is why I suggested trying 20P or 25P. I wouldn’t go over 17x8 and try 25P, this should sit the inside of the wheel and tyre close to where a 17x7.5 with 265/65/17 sits. The reason is the 25P pushes the wheel out 5mm but the rim is 12.7mm wider (6.35mm either side of centre) and thus the inside edge of the rim sits 1.35mm closer to the chassis. This setup will increase your track by 10mm overall. On the outside you have 5mm plus 6.35mm increase so rim sticks out 11.35mm more which may see the front tyres scrub at full lock on the front or rear of the tyre.
For what it’s worth if going with 265/65/17 you might as well stick with 17x7.5 in 30P offset and as long as the wheels and tyres match or exceed the load rating of the originals and you increase the rotor diameter you can’t go wrong. Plus it won’t scrub and you don’t need the ugly aftermarket flares.

[hiluxxury]

If you are going for 0 offset rims though and originals are 30P then you have a track increase of 60mm. That is why I suggested trying 20P or 25P. I wouldn’t go over 17x8 and try 25P, this should sit the inside of the wheel and tyre close to where a 17x7.5 with 265/65/17 sits. The reason is the 25P pushes the wheel out 5mm but the rim is 12.7mm wider (6.35mm either side of centre) and thus the inside edge of the rim sits 1.35mm closer to the chassis. This setup will increase your track by 10mm overall. On the outside you have 5mm plus 6.35mm increase so rim sticks out 11.35mm more which may see the front tyres scrub at full lock on the front or rear of the tyre.
For what it’s worth if going with 265/65/17 you might as well stick with 17x7.5 in 30P offset and as long as the wheels and tyres match or exceed the load rating of the originals and you increase the rotor diameter you can’t go wrong. Plus it won’t scrub and you don’t need the ugly aftermarket flares.

x2

[Tyson2Field]

Allright, I get ya, I'll have a look for some 17x8's that I like, and go with those rather than 17x9's, and a 20-25P offset and the 265/65x17 tyres - though I will still install some flares - it would appear to be a controversial opinion, but I like the way they look. Cheers for your help!