DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby Gipsy on Thu, 14 Feb 2019 8:06 +0000

Maybe methinks the problem here is that a certain person thinks it might be that some think you do a manual burn in your garage! I think grunff and others have the goods on how it all works. All the scenarios are given as when the engine is HOT. Sheesh I'm glad I have a n70 :shock: no worries about a dpf!
Cheers Gipsy :D although I'm sure somebody will challenge that :lol: even Einstein wasn't certain of his theories.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby Crusha on Thu, 14 Feb 2019 2:42 +0000

Booked the lux in for 100,000km service they said there was a DPF software update under warranty thought cool another one, when I picked it up a manual DPF switch was also added :lol: more buttons to press.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby Wayne'O75 on Thu, 14 Feb 2019 2:43 +0000

Bushwalker8 wrote:
ggreenie wrote: The button does literally nothing unless the whole system is already at operating temperature.


Not sure what point you are trying to make here in the context of the discussion but it is misleading.
The switch once armed by the fault condition can only be activated while the engine is running.
The fault warning will also normally come on while driving (simple probability).
So in most cases the system will be already at, or at least approaching sufficient temperature for the manual regeneration process to take over and increase it from there.
In the event that temperatures may be lower than required by the manual process, either before initiating the burn with the switch or during regeneration, Toyota have provided simple and clear instructions in the manual to increase revs temporarily to assist raising the temperature.


That's the way I interoperate the operation of the manual button. It's for when driving and it is unable to perform a burn for what ever reason; traffic, slow off road driving, driving down a mountain road. This is when the warning light will come on, for you to pull over, where safe in a clear area. Keep the engine running, and press the manual DPF burn button, for it to complete a burn cycle.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby grunf on Thu, 14 Feb 2019 2:45 +0000

spot on mate
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby mcflux on Sat, 16 Feb 2019 4:54 +0000

I had mine updated recently and like others have posted my DPF regens now go for approx. 15 mins rather than the 40 mins they were previously taking.

For me they're occurring at 400km intervals.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby grunf on Sat, 16 Feb 2019 5:27 +0000

recently I was driving up the winding mountain road (bitumen), mostly going up hill
regeneration started and it took much longer than usual 15 minutes to complete

as someone mentioned previously, maybe it was because engine was laboring and working hard and priorities were on engine injectors and delivering enough fuel to them rather than on 5th injector
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby Andyfive on Sat, 16 Feb 2019 5:44 +0000

Image
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby wildthing on Tue, 19 Feb 2019 8:39 +0000

wildthing wrote:I had my 2018 SR auto in for the DPF recall today.
They did the software upgrade and system inspection and also activated the DPF custom mode which gives a dashboard indication when a burn is under way - I haven't seen this in operation yet as have only driven home from the dealership.
However they declined my request to instal under warranty the over-ride switch for a manual burn....will have to see how I go at attempting to persuade Toyota to review that decision :?: :?


Toyota accepted my argument to also add the manual switch, based on the type of travel we use the Hilux for. Had it installed today for no charge, as an addition to the recall process, so must say I'm happy with their response to this issue.
I've also noticed that with the software upgrade the time required for the burn is much quicker than previously, and it's useful to have the dashboard notification when it's happening.
Cheers
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby JWilly81 on Thu, 28 Feb 2019 1:20 +0000

Not really DPF related but I'm hoping someone knows the EGR location on the 2016 Hilux. Cheers
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby ggreenie on Thu, 28 Feb 2019 3:03 +0000

JWilly81 wrote:Not really DPF related but I'm hoping someone knows the EGR location on the 2016 Hilux. Cheers

This page might help you.

https://toyota-club.net/files/faq/15-10 ... ne_eng.htm
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby mully man on Wed, 06 Mar 2019 4:20 +0000

Hi guys- quick qusetion for all those who have had the DPF update done.
Have just completed a 1200km round trip towing my boat and noticed that the DPF did a regen pretty much every 175-200km whilst on the open road, with these regens taking a minimum of 45 min & some over an hour to complete as opposed to the normal 15min 350km intervals i was getting under normal urban driving conditions. Im curious is this the ‘norm’ when towing as before the update i wouldnt have even known it was doing a burn but now obviously with the warning on the dash i can tell straight away.
Car is an auto SR5 late 2017 build, towing around 1200kg at roughly 95-100km/hr, never tow in top gear, always S4.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby wildthing on Fri, 08 Mar 2019 5:06 +0000

Have noticed my regen takes longer when towing, but not more frequent - still about every 300km
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby Bushwalker8 on Fri, 08 Mar 2019 5:36 +0000

mully man wrote: every 175-200km whilst on the open road, with these regens taking a minimum of 45 min & some over an hour to complete


I've not towed since the update but last two trips towing 1500kg over about 35,000km never anything like that, has always been around 300km and 20 mins or so burn. And I've kept a close eye on it with scanguage2. Doesn't sound right at all....
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby mully man on Fri, 08 Mar 2019 6:20 +0000

Cheers for the response guys- i’ll keep an eye on the frequency of the burns now im back home and see if it goes back to what it normally does. Seemed strange at the time, thought it may have had something to do with towing in S4 and the engine under more/constant load but i’m no mechanic so just guessing.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby wildthing on Mon, 25 Mar 2019 7:05 +0000

Hi all,
Have just done about 2000km around Vic, including the Grampians and the High Country, towing my camper at about 2.2 tonne (and driving mostly in S4).
This is my first longer trip after having the DPF recall attended to last month, when I also had the on-screen display and manual buurn switch installed.
Experience during this towing trip is that I was averaging a regen after only around 150km each time. The duration of the burn was anything from 15 minutes to 45 minutes, but probably averaging around 20 minutes.
This seems to me to be regeneration too frequently and possibly taking too long each time?
Any thoughts or experience from others on this forum as to whether this performance is reasonable?
I'm due for a regular sevice in the next few weeks, so probably should query the DPF performance based on my experience.
Comments appreciated,
Cheers
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby SR5-2018 on Mon, 25 Mar 2019 7:35 +0000

I've got a 2018 SR15 auto 54,000km. I do a reasonable amount of country driving, which does help the dpf operation, and generally she will only puff white smoke after I have done a few hundred km of heavy city driving, short cycle, stop start. It can get pretty bad if I feed it to her at the lights. I've had the initial software update, but have heard that getting the manual dpf switch and associated upgrade, will kill fuel consumption, so I haven't bothered. Since new, no matter what I do to her, flog her or take it easy, she averages around 9.7km pl - which is great for such a big car.

The VW dodgy emissions experience in the US - not the greatest idea to take your car in for the recall - you come out compliant but using more fuel and gutless to boot.

Unfortunately these sorts of issues are a fact of life with small EGR diesels. Buying one 2nd hand with big km, (any brand), out of warranty, could be a very painful experience. Having said that Toyota quality is generally superb. The software (and expensive to replace hardware - EGR cooler, Variable Geo Turbo, DPF, sensors etc) basically tries to control the production of NOx "strangling" the engine burn, by injecting a % of exhaust gas back into the engine. The exhaust from that controlled burn isn't as clean as it could be. So PM (particulate matter - soot) is generated, and trapped in the DPF, which is then burnt off. The SCR / adblue path on the other hand, tries to have as clean (efficient) engine burn as possible. This creates really good fuel consumption, hardly any soot, but a lot of NOx (a greenhouse gas), which is then treated with a urea solution injected into a Catalytic converter, creating nitrogen and water vapour. SCR still has its issues - adblue, tank, pump, dosing valve, sensors, Cat - all can have issues - but mechanically its a simpler solution, as the emissions control is done outside of the engine. From an engine mechanical problem side - experience in trucks has shown that as SCR has a very efficient hot clean fuel burn - the amount of unburnt hydrocarbons and PM in the exhaust is negligible - which historically used to lubricate the exhaust valves - so valve recession becomes more of a risk, and doing valve sets regularly more important. (That way you not only have the engine running better, put by measuring valve clearances, you detect the valve recession before the valve drops). Manufacturers have upgraded their valves and inserts to a harder steel as a result. Who would think by changing engine software, to get a highly efficient fuel burn, would cause a dropped valve, munched up piston, liner, injector, turbo and metal spread everywhere.

In 2008 Australia went to Euro 4 emissions regulations, and truck emission control methods were divided - the US products basically went EGR, and the European products went SCR. Euro 5 came in 2010 and that was tighter again - that's when DPFs had to be fitted to EGR engines, whereas SCR was just a software change. EGR was poison, super guts ache, and SCR is now the Australian truck emissions control system of choice. Though Isuzu and Freightliner still use EGR, and it is still an option with Kenworth Cummins 15 litre (a very seldom used option).

I stand to be corrected, but I think the Hilux engine will be set at Euro 6 standards, (there are 3 very similar standards - Euro, US and Japanese -all called different things - so I just will call that Euro6 ) yet to be mandated in Australia, probably due in 2022, if at all. Most heavy diesels are using a combination of SCR and EGR / DPF to achieve that (YUK!) But it certainly it can be achieved by just by EGR / DPF. I think all small diesels were forced to comply with Euro 5 back in 2010, not many years later. That could have been achieved with just EGR and no DPF. So potentially the current engine emissions set up, might not be legislatively required in our market. Like I said I stand to be corrected on that.

If only we could get a new Hilux with the Burma / Kenya emissions standards - Euro 3. No SCR or EGR! Go for a trillion km.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby mully man on Mon, 25 Mar 2019 9:00 +0000

wildthing wrote:Hi all,
Have just done about 2000km around Vic, including the Grampians and the High Country, towing my camper at about 2.2 tonne (and driving mostly in S4).
This is my first longer trip after having the DPF recall attended to last month, when I also had the on-screen display and manual buurn switch installed.
Experience during this towing trip is that I was averaging a regen after only around 150km each time. The duration of the burn was anything from 15 minutes to 45 minutes, but probably averaging around 20 minutes.
This seems to me to be regeneration too frequently and possibly taking too long each time?
Any thoughts or experience from others on this forum as to whether this performance is reasonable?
I'm due for a regular sevice in the next few weeks, so probably should query the DPF performance based on my experience.
Comments appreciated,
Cheers


Hey mate- this sounds like the same experience i had whilst towing my boat after the recall was done to my car. Since coming back to work and doing my normal driving again its back to normal- every 350kms/15-20min unlike when towing....
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby mitchnewy on Mon, 25 Mar 2019 3:00 +0000

I've got a 2016 manual 2.8 SR5. 26000km. For close to 3 years it has done Regens every 330-350km. In recent months it now does it at 450km. I've had the latest software update and switch installed.

Is this normal? I'm not seeing any issues. I'm getting low 7L/100km economy in normal mode.
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby gjn on Mon, 25 Mar 2019 6:15 +0000

mitchnewy wrote:I've got a 2016 manual 2.8 SR5. 26000km. For close to 3 years it has done Regens every 330-350km. In recent months it now does it at 450km. I've had the latest software update and switch installed.

Is this normal? I'm not seeing any issues. I'm getting low 7L/100km economy in normal mode.


My manual is much the same, prior to the update a regen every 300 to 330 km, after the update it's around the 450km mark. Fuel economy stable on 8.4 ever since the upgrade (SR SCC so the aerodynamics of a house brick...)
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Re: DPF blowing smoke, ECM update, Replacement etc

Postby grunf on Mon, 25 Mar 2019 7:04 +0000

gents your fuel usage ... is it as per car computer or is it real figures (calculating litres and km's driven after filling up?)

as per my signature, I installed heaps of accessories and have lift kit, bulbar, winch etc, my fuel figures are more around 10.8 to 11.7 (real life - not car computer)

I find it hard to believe hilux n80 would use 7l per 100km, even with no accessories
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