Is a chip really that good?

[J&L]

I read in the information sheet by most Chip suppliers that they do not alter the common rail pressure or timing and still get 10 to 20% more power from an engine. Most say they extend the 'on' period of a trigger to the injector. My understanding from this is they effectively 'overfuel' the engine to produce more power. How can this then reduce the fuel consumption?

[toyboata]

They do increase fuel pressure also and thus add more fuel. This is ok at some load points as there is residual air to allow more fuel.
Modules like the Chip-It also increase boost pressure to add more air with the fuel so there is no over fueling.
Along with the increase in boost it also has some control over the electronic wastegate which allows the turbo to spool up faster and at lower revs and engine loads.
After having my chip for over a year now I for the first time last week did a whole tank of fuel with the chip turned off.
I got about 60 km less from the tank and the difference in performance was huge! I already was very pleased with the chip but driving for a week without it, then switching it back on I really noticed just how much better the overall performance of the vehicle was with the chip.

[J&L]

I agree then. To get a better atomizing of the diesel for better combustion you have to increase the rail pressure. The boost pressure is mechanicaly limited and you need to fit a boost controller to increase the boost. These are the areas that will positively increase engine power and torque. Yet, according to the write up of the Chip suppliers they don't do it. Another thing, as these Chips are so much faster to respond than your right foot, you will feel the difference. To increase the airflow through the engine (free flow air filter) and to increase exhaust size with a freeflow system, the resuls will be significant already.

[brusa]

Yes

[dute]

Brusa you must really really really like this chip thread . . . .

[jimO]

seeing as we all know what injector problems the D4d has had will a chip make them a bigger problem than they already are

[toyboata]

I agree then. To get a better atomizing of the diesel for better combustion you have to increase the rail pressure. The boost pressure is mechanicaly limited and you need to fit a boost controller to increase the boost. These are the areas that will positively increase engine power and torque. Yet, according to the write up of the Chip suppliers they don't do it. Another thing, as these Chips are so much faster to respond than your right foot, you will feel the difference. To increase the airflow through the engine (free flow air filter) and to increase exhaust size with a freeflow system, the resuls will be significant already.

The boost limit is computer controlled on the D4D. With my Chip-it chip the boost is increased from 16psi to 20-21psi.
The MAP sensor readings are manipulated to increase boost pressure and also to allow quicker spool up and increased boost much sooner than standard.

[helmut79]

I love my chip, would not go without

[scottsr20]

J if you wanna unbolt your intercooler (you need to lift the intercooler to access the injector plugs) I will lend you my VMN chip for a week so you can try it .

PM me - I'm in Thornlands.

[Jack S]

Or there is a few blokes on here that are selling the Chip It Modules, pretty cheap too, might save you a little coin...

[Hellbound]

J if you wanna unbolt your intercooler (you need to lift the intercooler to access the injector plugs) I will lend you my VMN chip for a week so you can try it .

PM me - I'm in Thornlands.

Howdy Scott, what do u rekon about the VMN chip overall?

[J&L]

I'm aware of the increase the chip brings. My question is if you read the flyers, and you understand how this works then somethings does not match up. What is computor controlled in the turbo is the vane angle to allow quicker spool as well as the pressure limit. If you increase boost pressure and common rail pressure you will get better performance and hence better fuel economy.
What is important is the protection that's built in a system to oversee this elevated pressures and protect an engine. Just know I'm not making the chip off as a bad device . . . by no means. I'm irretated when products are advertized and basic knowledge expose the lie.
A Chip without EGT protection spells danger and you should fit a EGT gauge to warn you when you push the limits. If more fuel is forced in an engine, temperatures skyrocket. The turbo spooling at 100'000rpm+ and redhot vanes cause metal fatigue and you have a vaneless turbo soon.

[danmcccc]

these chips in there out of the box form are only a very mild tune tho...i agree that temp is the killer coz IT IS...but they do make a difference coz the power increase might only be small but its viewed by us as relative to the intial power so it seems to be vastly diferent

[scottsr20]

The reality is that diesel has a specific calorific content and the engines relative efficiency has not been changed ( unless you add a free flowing intake and exhaust as you stated earlier) so if you want more power it will cost you more at the bowser. I think you will find that most chip manufacturers will not claim to make more power while using less fuel- the two are generally mutually exclusive. With the VMN chip on mine, driven gently I can definitely save fuel, but when I use the extra power available I use more fuel than standard. I'd be surprised if there was any chip that wasn't much the same. As for the coment of 'any chip without EGT protection spell danger' ( and know that I'm not trying to sell you on the chip I have - hence me offering to lend you mine so you can see for yourself on your own car how a chip makes a difference ) the majority of these chips are interceptors- that is they take the signal intended for the injector/fuel pump/ boost controller or whatever parameter the tuner has chosen to alter, feed it through an algorithum and then send it on to the relavent hardware. The factory safety nets such as air/fuel ratio probes, intake and egt sendors etc are not altered as there is enough head room to facilitate the mild increases in power we are getting .
I don't have any association with any chip manufacturer, my offer stands - if you want to try for yourself its here ( might as well try a throttle controller too while your voiding your waranty !!)

[J&L]

Thanks Scottsr20 for the offer but no thanks. I had a Chip in my previous ute and after some extensive time at the dyno I learnt a hell of a lot about them. This was a few years ago and technology changes rapidly. Diesel is only midway to exploit all its potential. Look at a halogan lamp 30% light and 70% heat. The HID technology dramatically changed that now. I'm testing the technology now by asking this question as the basics are known around diesel. Will the next level of diesel-power extration be more than what we discover now or can it be done with software. When I started programming it was on the Atari and Commodore PC's using Basic. Now I lost track with all the tools available. This is probably the same with modern engine and fuel technology. Its important that suppliers know that people out there do talk and share experiences and false information do tend to cause people loosing confidence in the market as a whole.

[helmut79]

I will expand on my comments above.

For the price of the VMN chip (same as Scottsr20 runs) of $995 the power (torque) and efficiency gains are great. Like Scott said if you use the loud pedal you will use more fuel. But if you drive normally and watch the right boot you can extend your usage figures.

It sounds like you have put allot of thought into this purchase so I would suggest you take up Scotts offer and try it out for a week and see what you think of the chip.

Just for the record I have 31’s and a Rekon lift, full bar work and winch, diesel auto run the A/C all the time and get between 500Km – 600Km around town depend on the right boot usage. On the Hwy get between 650km – 780km from the tank which is only about a 66L – 69L fill when the light comes on.

Hope this helps.

[Hellbound]

AND the VMN only adjusts injector timing / duration and doesnt alter fuel rail pressure, which means its one of the safest ways of achieving thee extra power and absolutely no limp home codes thrown at all.

[J&L]

Helmut, I agree wih you and here come my argument. Chip IT acknowledge they alter the rail and boost presssure but have protection in place well within the parameters. VMN say No, they don't. Physics say for more power AND economy you need higher rail pressure (compare old diesel technology to Common rail) and possible higher boost.
VMN is actually a Throttle booster - altering the injection duration - similar like an ultra fast foot accelerator. If it is not the case, and they do not alter the pressures, they have discovered a new technology to increase the energy extraction from diesel in laymans terms. I don't want to do Brand bashing but somewhere someone try to rewrite the laws of physics (and chemistry!)

[danmcccc]

so really the vmn chip alters the injection timing and duration like how a lumpy cam works on a carburettor engine???

[Hellbound]

Heres about as much as i know about these types of chips, more than happy to be corrected here as we can all learn something...

VMN only adjusts is the timing and duration of the injector cycles, no pressure adjustments to the actual fuel rail as it isnt what this type of chip is designed to do. Chip-It on the other hand adjusts both the injector timing /duration and increase the rail pressure for even more power, as timing adjustments only can only increase power within a certain range before more rail pressure is needed. This is where some other cheaper chips have problems because they ONLY raise fuel rail pressure, and as the fuel rail sensor is very sensitive to changes it can throw the car into limp mode, thats why these are the inferior types of chips to get as fas as i can see.

As with all engines since the dawn of time the more fuel you can fit into the combustion chamber - matched to the correct amount of air then you are going to make more power during the power stroke, limited by the physical size of the combustion chamber. So in a way altering the timing and duration means you are holding each injector open for longer at the correct time of the stroke and thus putting more fuel in, so along with a correct amount of air you are going to get more power than standard.


Maybe someone on here knows more about the difference between just pumping more fuel in during normal injector cycles at an increased set rate across the rev range, or altering the opening duration of the injector only during a tweaked timing sequence without raising the pressure. Cos i for one dont know the answer to that but both methods achieve the same effect but do it in different ways. What way is the safest who knows but limp mode is a scary thing to experience when your trying to overtake a road train at 120km...